What really happen whit civilians at the end

Feedback and debriefings from Berget 9
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A_Muller
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Post by A_Muller » 05 Jul 2011, 12:28

Well, I was there, and I saw others not taking hits as well from my bursts to their heads, heck. I even saw where my BBs had hit once they passed me.

How do we know they were russian? They spoke russian.
It's sad that stereotyping during these events does indeed emerge, but the two times I've been to berget I've always confronted the cheaters (who, unluckily, have been russian on those occations), and everytime I get cursed at and threatened by physical violence (luckily this year I was "only" pushed around until one guy who understood some english deflated the situation by being able to explain the situation to his teammates before they started to throw punches).

I did take the cheater's armband number and reported him to my 2IC, who seemed to write it down for a report.

All in all the only conclusion I can come to is that if you go to international events you MUST be able to at least speak english to a decent degree, otherwise misunderstandings can turn really ugly. It really is that simple.
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Post by parresurre1 » 05 Jul 2011, 12:41

To answer your questions.

1. The guy had a russian flag on his arm, He spoked bad english with russian dialect and finaly a Berget Crew member told me there were russians who made the attack.

2. In the other incident they spoke russian, I shot them from a very short distance and I saw the bullets bouncin of them. I have a very solid military backround and know how to shoot. I cant exactly say if I hit 10 or 12 guys but it was clear that it was about as many.

The Russian guy that took the hit and the medic healing him congratulated me for the great ambush and said he was sorry that the others did not take their hits so all creds to him!

The first incident were probably caught on video by I team I know so I hope It can be aired on You Tube in near future.
De Oppresso Liber

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Post by parresurre1 » 05 Jul 2011, 12:46

To answer your questions.

1. The guy had a russian flag on his arm, He spoked bad english with russian dialect and finaly a Berget Crew member told me there were russians who made the attack.

2. In the other incident they spoke russian, I shot them from a very short distance and I saw the bullets bouncin of them. I have a very solid military backround and know how to shoot. I cant exactly say if I hit 10 or 12 guys but it was clear that it was about as many.

The Russian guy that took the hit and the medic healing him congratulated me for the great ambush and said he was sorry that the others did not take their hits so all creds to him!
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Post by alecu » 05 Jul 2011, 12:54

guys, let me tell you what i come to understand, that it is all about the group that you will engage.

Take example. Last Day, we got in a firefight with a squad that absolutely nuke us, and did not took their hits, after 10 minutes, me and my last 2 standing guys, we got engaged by other group that actually we killed them, one or two bbs shot to their direction was enough.

SO ... it is not about the color or the country, its about the habits that people have.

I can remember that at my first Berget, people where saying about Italians this stuff, this year, Charlie the leader of the Portuguese Foxes had an squad of Italians in his command also, and he told me that they where very fair play.



True, i have a list with armband id's that my guys collected, but i will not open the case now, i will just review the cases, and i will post the ones who where insane and 100% sure that they did not assume the hits taken.

I am now waiting to see the Black List of Berget, because this year was an orgy of people not taking their hits, lots of complaints, and arguments.
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Post by A_Muller » 05 Jul 2011, 12:58

Oh of course there's 10 great playing guys for every rotten apple, which is why the stereotyping is sad, I'm sure there are people from all nationalities that does cheat and all needs to be adressed, BUT the only occations where I've witnessed it have been when russians have been fired upon. And since the majority of them don't speak english a simple misunderstanding can (and have) turned real ugly physically. This is why I cannot overstate the fact that if you don't know english, don't attend.
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Post by mc205 » 05 Jul 2011, 13:21

alecu wrote:guys, let me tell you what i come to understand, that it is all about the group that you will engage.
.......
SO ... it is not about the color or the country, its about the habits that people have.
............
+1 for Alecu

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Post by Brujo » 05 Jul 2011, 13:57

So at the bottom of this thread, which is supposed to discuss LARP affairs, I yet again read about cheating.

Guys, we all understand your frustrations. We all have stories to tell. We too have witnessed good and bad examples of airsoft in the past.

Please, don't be messy and do not mix topics. Open your own cheating threads and let your emotions run free in there.
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Post by vitex » 05 Jul 2011, 14:06

1.Most of my people did not carry. Russian tricolor flag
2.all of my men have patch with RSA on it
3.you are so experienced in languages to make different between Russian,Poland , Bulgaria, and others by a few words?
Anyway you think all who speaks Russian came from Russia?
Then everyone who speaks English came from GB this way.
So stop this monkey business and give me exact Id.
Even one.
Ps
Hitting of 10-12 men with one lowcap looks like a some kind of fairy tale or you(probably) just an ambitious airsoft newbie with Rambo complex.
PPS
Hey guys don't you no that the cold war is over?

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Post by cf_dima » 05 Jul 2011, 14:50

The Russian guy that took the hit and the medic healing him congratulated me for the great ambush and said he was sorry that the others did not take their hits so all creds to him!
I know that episode - it happened on Thursday during the attack of the NAF base by 1st and 2nd Coys of Mountaineers.
My squad medic (Batya) was the guy who hailed you with good ambush and he mentioned that to me later as well as you hit 5 (five) guys that all stayed on the ground and were treated by our medics.
1st Coy was indeed the Russian although both companies have mixed up during the attack by that moment so the possibility that there was a mix of the Russians and non-Russians on that road is pretty high.

Same battle there was episode with, how we called it, "the vicotry marsh of multicam", when number of guys wearing that camo were running toward us and shooting even after MG bursts were bouncing off them ;).

I didn't want to start it but even some guys from BE crew was telling us that it was the first time they have seen so many cheating from the NAF side - probably because of the number of the very young airsofters with the NAF.

Anyway, that whole cheating thing stinks and I hope everyone had a good game overall despite the number of unpleasant moments happened now and then :).

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Post by cf_dima » 05 Jul 2011, 14:56

Dima, just to make the UN guy incident clear:
- the guy was NOT the UN commander, he was the boss of UN Military Police (and a. very corrupt one)
- we hated him because he was trying to extort protection from us
- I personally paid one of the Russian Poldavians to brings us this guy once they captured him
- I personally shot him with a. 44 magnum and one of my guys knifekilled him so that he couldn't be healed.
This shows how far you might from correctly understanding whats going on even though you're convinced you know whats going on.
Yeah, that's called a fog of war :).
But as i've mentioned in the first post, i tried to describe how it looked from our side.

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Post by Hell_Viking » 05 Jul 2011, 15:24

cf_dima wrote:
Dima, just to make the UN guy incident clear:
- the guy was NOT the UN commander, he was the boss of UN Military Police (and a. very corrupt one)
- we hated him because he was trying to extort protection from us
- I personally paid one of the Russian Poldavians to brings us this guy once they captured him
- I personally shot him with a. 44 magnum and one of my guys knifekilled him so that he couldn't be healed.
This shows how far you might from correctly understanding whats going on even though you're convinced you know whats going on.
Yeah, that's called a fog of war :).
But as i've mentioned in the first post, i tried to describe how it looked from our side.
Again, I was the CO UN MP. and I LOVED this incident ! It was great to be hit and brutaly killed like that. Shook both guys hands afterwards , and thanked them both for a good moment
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Post by Jin » 05 Jul 2011, 16:25

God damn,game is over.
All misunderstanding or cheating issue must be solved on the FIELD not on the forum.
(You dont have ID of those players = your fault)
There is a expression in russian language "Dont wave you fists after battle is over"

When BB hit people from 10-12m - they really can feel the BB's hitting them,they must be freaking undead walking to walk away from this.
I'd say this is BS.

And one more thing,in every squad of 1st Coy (Russian COY)there was at least one guy who speak fluent english.

This topic goes to somewhere else rather of Janco Attack
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Post by MrMedic » 05 Jul 2011, 17:23

About the UN shooting Poldavians on sight rather than letting them into Janco for a bit of roleplaying:

As a UN Company commander I really tried to handle things by diplomacy as far as possible. The first day we managed to get the Poldavians to respect the DMZ, and several Poldavians units moved through town peacefully (even though they did manage to shoot two UN soldiers in the process).

We would have liked nothing better than to keep it that way. There where 60 UN players in all, picking a fight with the entire Poldavian army was not high on our to-do list.

The second day the Poldavians seems to have changed their mind about accepting our presence and DMZ. When asked to dismount and surrender their weapons they either a) charged and massacred all UN personell or b) went back down the road, flanked us and took position on the mountain above the UN Camp, from where they poured machine gun fire into the camp.

After a couple of such episodes I think it is safe to say that the UN stopped regarding negotiations as a viable solution when it came to the Poldavians.

Which is strange really, since our mission orders clearly stated that we recognized Janco as a Poldavian town and that if anything the Poldavians where more entitled to it than the NAF: In short we started out Pro Poldavian but were shot and butchered by the Poldavians into accepting the opposite.

Also, all UN personell wore their UN Blue headwear until it was clear that doing so was a death sentence since Poldavians shot any and all UN soldiers they could get their hands on. After that most of us went with brassards and camo headwear.

As a player I would have prefered to keep the "all is welcome into the DMZ whilst unarmed" - policy for at least a bit longer, to allow for a more varied gamed, and to allow the civvies to interact with the Poldavians. As it was that option was shut down far too early.

I feel sorry for the players who feel cheated out of all chances for peaceful roleplaying or just wanting to move through town, and hope that if there is ever another "neutral" town it's defenders will be more successful at keeping it neutral than we were.
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Post by mc205 » 05 Jul 2011, 18:10

Perhaps, to avoid all the problems involving the inhabitants of Janco and the UN forces, it would be better to ban weapons to the villagers too.

In this way, the villagers would remain neutral and could have LARP with both factions.

Doc

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Post by Lentus » 05 Jul 2011, 18:14

About the traffictickets and so on.

I have talked with the REAL un, Swedish police and all laws i could find.

un soldiers are not allowed to write tickets. The local police, the janco police, scould have done it. So we was right from the start. And yeah, we had a local policeman
Hehe

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