three things to consider for the Berget Crew.

Feedback e debriefings from Berget 7.
jry2000
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Post by jry2000 » 01 Jul 2009, 11:35

Well, I wanted to start a new thread, but it seems someone has been faster. So basically

I've been part of Milo's Tigers, Bengali coy (approx 30 ppl, Czech, Slovak, Romanian). Three different kinds of people. We've been assigned to guard duty of our camp at Wednesday 10PM and left there till Friday 1AM without exchange of people and almost without rest. Later I've found out, that Sibria coy had absolutely the SAME issue and did not have any action at all till Friday (almost half of the game) and India coy has been out almost whole time out. Sibria and Bengali coy have been almost half of all Milo's Tigers if I am not wrong which were downed at base camp . We had absolutely no information what was going on at all and we were guarding camp because of we were guarding camp.

Honestly sitting at 300m of ground for almost 2 days does not match my definition of:
Berget 7 will continue to be a airsoft-game featuring Milsim and LARP. Our goal is to keep the title “the largest international airsoft event in the world” with colossal airsoft battles on an epic scale.

This caused a really tensed (and understandable) relations within our coy and with our commanding staff as well. Unfortunately we did not get support from our commanding stuff until the situation went real bad on personal level. I've been witness of verbal insult on my country, my team, my fellow colleagues and me as well from our commanding officer which I did not appreciate at all, I won't forget that for a long time.

As for following Bergets, I'd wish to have better action planning because we don't have to pay a lot of money and have a long journey just to sit somewhere on sun for 2 days. And actually I'd prefer on commanding level someone with advanced people skills , because I don't want hell we've experienced this year to come again.
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Berget 8 - Not joining as player

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wormbyte
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Post by wormbyte » 01 Jul 2009, 13:25

1. Make NATO MilSim. In fact create factions to match players game styles. So that if they want LARP then they can join the Civilians, if they want soldiering levels of MilSim then join NATO.

2. Have a minimum 3 Berget staff at the bases so that commanders can do the job of commanding instead of doing things that Berget Staff should be doing.

3. Get the formula working for 1000 players before increasing to 2000. Logistic and resource issues stretched B7 to near breaking point with 1000 players. Go to 2000 players and you WILL go beyond breaking point. Don't bite more than you can chew guys. There will ocome a time when the Berget event will grow to 2000 players and beyond but get your resource issues addressed first.
B6 - Platoon Commander (India 1st Platoon) - NATO
B7 - Company Commander (India Coy) - NATO
B10 - 3rd Rangers Commander
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B13 - GCT Para Inf - Company Commander
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Beckett
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Post by Beckett » 01 Jul 2009, 13:42

wormbyte wrote:1. Make NATO MilSim. In fact create factions to match players game styles. So that if they want LARP then they can join the Civilians, if they want soldiering levels of MilSim then join NATO.

2. Have a minimum 3 Berget staff at the bases so that commanders can do the job of commanding instead of doing things that Berget Staff should be doing.

3. Get the formula working for 1000 players before increasing to 2000. Logistic and resource issues stretched B7 to near breaking point with 1000 players. Go to 2000 players and you WILL go beyond breaking point. Don't bite more than you can chew guys. There will ocome a time when the Berget event will grow to 2000 players and beyond but get your resource issues addressed first.
Cheers! Could not agree more.
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Post by Bersu » 01 Jul 2009, 16:32

If you decide to call one side NATO, you must not be hesitated to enforce discipline to make the NATO side work even remotely like one. If large groups go rogue, they should be warned, restricted and/or eventually banned. Theres just no other way, if they cant understand the meaning of playing for NATO side.
Berget 7 - SRP - Fox 3
Berget 8 - Poldovian 1st Inf
Berget 9 - The Firm & Zansian Blackops A03
Berget 10 - Zansian Blackguard
Berget 11 - GCT SFODU

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Post by Lesjak » 01 Jul 2009, 20:28

Bersu wrote:If you decide to call one side NATO, you must not be hesitated to enforce discipline to make the NATO side work even remotely like one. If large groups go rogue, they should be warned, restricted and/or eventually banned. Theres just no other way, if they cant understand the meaning of playing for NATO side.
Nobody played NATO, since there weren't much of the peacekeeping missions for them. After the 1st day it was all about shoot 1st then ask questions. I doubt that any smaller force would carelesly open fire upon a larger force, like NATO. So you cant say play by NATO standards if there aren't any!

Firstly define what NATO is and then tell people how to act NATO like.
Berget 7 - NATO India 4th platoon

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Post by Bersu » 01 Jul 2009, 21:06

Lesjak wrote:Nobody played NATO, since there weren't much of the peacekeeping missions for them. After the 1st day it was all about shoot 1st then ask questions. I doubt that any smaller force would carelesly open fire upon a larger force, like NATO. So you cant say play by NATO standards if there aren't any!

Firstly define what NATO is and then tell people how to act NATO like.
Well, my message was to the berget crew. But since you asked, dont you know what NATO is all about? What ROE's all about? Usually NATO does not go and shoot civilians or atleast they will have decreased support for that. Secondly NATO doesnt rob places. If you did know that, why are you asking me?

If there was shoot on sight orders for all the other military factions, then why NATO did shoot police and civilians? Also you talked about peacekeeping. Well NATO is more about peacemaking if you ask me and so it was in this game. However that doesnt mean NATO shoots everybody.

If you say there wasnt any NATO standards, then you just proved my point! There shouldnt be a NATO side if its only a bunch of geardo's shooting everything that moves.

That being said, I already read that some of the NATO did act accordingly. My original message was to suggest to eliminate the speedballers that dont obey orders and kill innocent civilians, rob casinos ect. If you feel the NATO was a wreckless bunch of soldiers to begin with, then Im even more concerned..
Berget 7 - SRP - Fox 3
Berget 8 - Poldovian 1st Inf
Berget 9 - The Firm & Zansian Blackops A03
Berget 10 - Zansian Blackguard
Berget 11 - GCT SFODU

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Re: ...

Post by Sebbe » 01 Jul 2009, 22:24

55nilsson wrote:I played NATO so this is mainly from the NATO-base...

1. The toiletts, well if you can call them that... Did whoever build them try them out??? Don´t think so. The seat was about 30 to 40 cm to high, and you had to jump up on the seat, and sit on a non-treated wooden seat, which after a day was anything but sanitary.
And for God sake, don´t make the door from tarp, that can´t be locked.

2. Running water... Please put more than 1 sink in a base with almost 450 players, or atleast put up a sign that says "No washing or doing dishes in the sink, just fill your bottle or camelback and get the Hell out of the way"

3. Patches...Don´t say that you will provide them if you can´t, and if you can, make sure - The hard part of velcro go on the patch , the soft part go on the clothes!!! Not the other way around!! :evil:

4. The helicopter...Don´t use it again and correct the above instead!
1. Agreed, the "toilets"(with i's "doors") were utter shit (no pun intended), but atleast they didn't smell bad.

2. 3 more sinks, and some hot water for the showers, i mean, what the hell? I showered one day, and it was a pain in the ass. Also, make the cover better, i'm the shy kind and i didn't like the fact that the girls in the kiosk and the rest of NATO base could see my pale white ass while showering.

3. Agreed, alot.

4. This has to be what i agree the most on, the helicopter was such a HUGE waste of money, i can't even describe how useless it was! :cry:
B7- NATO, Bravo Coy, 2'nd Platoon, 1'st Squad
Crapgame wrote:Put a sticker on it that says, "shoot me im with B5"

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Post by Roska » 01 Jul 2009, 23:01

You had shower? Nice. :D

In the army I survived 14 days without a shower, I assume you guys could do the same for few days :P

No showers in the SRP base, and we did just fine :)

Get alcoholic moisture towels, if you have to clean yourself real bad (armpits, buttcrack etc.) and use disinfection liquids. This should be enough for you to survive. I agree though that players coming by airplane should have a chance to shower after the game properly. Ones by their own car or by boat/ferry can survive without :)

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Post by Sebbe » 01 Jul 2009, 23:13

Well i'm not you, i enjoy showers, i'm not a hardcore motherf**ker that likes to go on without a shower, sure i went on without showers but i didn't like it, this aint a thread where i can post my opinions and then some random other player saws it, it's a thread where i post so that the BE crew know what they did wrong and whatnot.
Sorry for the harsh answer but it's my personal preference, if i knew that there wouldn't be any (real) showers i would have talked to my friend's mother that lives in Härnösand. Didn't you SRP, Milo and Yuri guys have a beach close to your bases? I'd rather take a bath in the ocean instead of showing my ass to the whole base.

I'm asking you: Do you prefer not to have any showers infront of having showers?
B7- NATO, Bravo Coy, 2'nd Platoon, 1'st Squad
Crapgame wrote:Put a sticker on it that says, "shoot me im with B5"

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Post by Tystnad » 01 Jul 2009, 23:17

Sebbe: You should also consider the fact that NATO was the only faction that HAD showers. :wink:
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Post by Sebbe » 01 Jul 2009, 23:19

Well i feel bad for them.
I'll say again: I'm not the hardcore kinda guy that likes to be full of sweat-mixed dust together with blood and camopaint, but some other guys might like that. Good for them, bad for me.
B7- NATO, Bravo Coy, 2'nd Platoon, 1'st Squad
Crapgame wrote:Put a sticker on it that says, "shoot me im with B5"

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Post by L4gi » 01 Jul 2009, 23:21

SRP did not have a shower, but I think some guys walked a few kilometers to the beach near us and washed there. Didnt hear anyone whining about not having showers either. I think the first time most of us took a shower was in the boat we took back to Finland.
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Post by Tystnad » 01 Jul 2009, 23:28

What Im saying is; Complaing about the showers is just... Greedy, really.
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Post by Roska » 01 Jul 2009, 23:32

Sebbe wrote:Well i'm not you, i enjoy showers, i'm not a hardcore motherf**ker that likes to go on without a shower
I am hardly a hardcore motherfister! Even in the army I served in a rather sketchy, well fed and taken care unit as a Military Police :D

I just find it somewhat... well, lame, to complain about the showers. I do agree though, that the conditions you had to take your shower were low, but actually having one is something of a wonderful thing :)

Naturally, if it's a great personal problem, then there ought to be a chance to take a proper shower. All I'm saying, is it really THAT necessary? What is the biggest trouble you get from not being able to shower? A bit of itch in the armpits and the smell? There are tips for these problems that ease those a lot if needed. Hell, you can even ask my privately for all sorts of survival tips! I'm happy to share! :)

I never asked nor was given a chance to go to some beach. I never knew there was one. Had I known, I probably still wouldn't have gone as few days being sweaty and all that isn't that big a deal to me.

You've got to harden yourselves soldier! :)

To answer your question, I have taken quite a few showers in front of rather large group of males naked (we used to have half a company lined up for the 3 showers that we got in the army, everyone staring at you while you wasghed :D). I wouldn't really mind if someone saw my butt in a airsoft game while taking a shower, if it's something that turns them on then fine - if they are horrified... well, that's fine too. Butts are awesome, because everyone has one and they are all pretty much the same.

Anyways, don't get too angry, after all, we're all different ;)
Last edited by Roska on 01 Jul 2009, 23:33, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by motorhead » 01 Jul 2009, 23:32

wormbyte wrote:1. Make NATO MilSim. In fact create factions to match players game styles. So that if they want LARP then they can join the Civilians, if they want soldiering levels of MilSim then join NATO.

2. Have a minimum 3 Berget staff at the bases so that commanders can do the job of commanding instead of doing things that Berget Staff should be doing.

3. Get the formula working for 1000 players before increasing to 2000. Logistic and resource issues stretched B7 to near breaking point with 1000 players. Go to 2000 players and you WILL go beyond breaking point. Don't bite more than you can chew guys. There will ocome a time when the Berget event will grow to 2000 players and beyond but get your resource issues addressed first.
What the man said. Couldn't agree more.

And more seriously: How in the name of airsoft are we gonna keep players play their roles within the roles they're mandated by Berget Events when we see what happened with rogue activity this year?

Berget infrastructure at present stretched to its limits and beyond its capabilities with 1500 players.

Berget-Events responsibility extends only to the planning, game setup and logistic side, while the ingame commanders must take the brunt of making the event actually work as planned. This is not a streamlined organisation by far, with high turnover in the leadership ranks, and the different airsoft player cultures clashed out of control this year with less than 2000 players.

Based on this years experience:
BE must first sort out this years formula before extending the number of players. B7 proved that the task of keeping an ingame fraction of 500+ players happy is beyond the capabilities of most ingame leaders and BE-crew.

These issues must be adressed before anything else. We need a more solid ingame infrastructure and more professional quality ingame leaders if this is gonna work for all players.
Last edited by motorhead on 16 Jul 2009, 14:56, edited 1 time in total.
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B6: NATO, Oscar COY, 3rd PLT, 3rd squad
B7: NATO S6 - smoke signal operator
B8: Pol. 3rd Mount. S6/Liaison - ditto
B9: Pol. 3rd Mount. Com dude - ditto
B10: On leave
B11: Hot Dog

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