*** NATO feedback thread ***

Topics and things concerning this game and your experience and memories.
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Salvador
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Post by Salvador » 30 Jun 2008, 16:51

Ober-Lix wrote:
Salvador wrote:For now the only thing which I wish to share is:............messhole.
I very rarely lose my rag ! The situation you are refering to were beginning to run out of hand an shouting and screeming: " Lets go and kill them all!" or " never mind the bastards, we finish them off !" Had nothing to do with the mission you were supposed to execute. Running around like wild animals does not reflect very good behaviour and in no way a soldiers. I have called no one in particular a pig but I am not having anyone running nuts. On top of that came BE constandly changing their mind and informations.
You were unhappy ? What about me ?

Ober-Lix
Ober-Lix I would like to settle this with you by email: and I hope we (golf coy) just got a bad start. In the end you are the one who was an OP command with the power to change things. Of course I can understand you were unhappy. But I also understand all the reasons causing that unhappiness and I am not sure if considering the facts, it would be a legitimate excuse for what happened here. Again in the end you are the one who was an OP command with the power to change things one way or another.

By the way: not everybody was yelling and doing (and what they were shouting was a direct and specific order on the mission by OP Command).

Most of us sacrificed their game time and did stay on their watchposts as ordered. Me and Bloodhound non-stop for 14 hours at the second day -alone at main gate without backup or explanation -, also -of whom I can tell from experience- the rest of 1st Golf Coy did a great job.

So generalizing is never good thing to do. If some people of Golf coy behaved bad, why punish the whole coy for it.. If you lost your temper, which you would not expect from a commander but ok, understandable in certain situations. again; "it does not reflect very good behaviour and in no way a commanders."

But hey, I am not that short sighted so apologies are accepted, when given.... But I guess this is where the whole problem lies.

And please don't go calling the whole Golf coy unexperienced milsimmers, cause we talked 1 minute, we met you 1 time, so please do tell me......
On what are these conclusions based!?????? Cause it is so easy to classify someone as bad, but what are the real motivations. Tell us, it is facts we want not personal grunts as we expect are the ones now in play..

From the minute we arrived we helped building and defending the base (far in advance from official game time). so I am really really curious and with me far more people.

And to end my post; I do not bother walking miles and miles or have guard duty, hell that's part of the job I come here for. But note the word PART!
Imagine you get back to Italy, Denmark or where-ever you travelled thousands of miles from and have to reply on the question how the Berget experience was... "We'll we stood guard the whole time...". How would you feel?

Golf coy, 1st plt; my sincere respect for not deserting and staying until (almost) the end and taking over the guard duties of other (absence) coys!

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Post by HARDSU!T » 30 Jun 2008, 20:14

After 3 Days just doing Basedefence and doing nearly nothings, I talked to Brujo. He said to me that the Golf Coy isn't qualified enough. in his eyes.
I mean who the F*** is he to say that?!? We Were send to India 9 to stay there and wait for following instructions. After staying there abaut nearly 2 hours we went back. Arrived in the camp we got the information that Brujo and Ober-lix are at Mc Donalds! Great Comanders did we have Guy's! I have payed a lot of money that Brujo and Oberlix spend my money for the fun of mostely the Fox Coy! And this are just a few examples of the whole story.

So pissed off from the whole Event and a lot of more from Brujo and Oberlix.

And Oberlix shouldn't begin to shout to loud of the behavior of animals. I know what happened on the way home with your guy's Oberlix. We have picked them up. So Be fuckin quiet!

Greets to the other Golfcoy guy's who stood behind us!

HARDSU!T 2nd Golf Coy.

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ic dead people
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Post by ic dead people » 30 Jun 2008, 20:28

So, a long time i'm thinking about what i write in this topic.
But now i sleep it over and i can say: i think Golf Coy was planed only for rule playing
and extras they played Soldiers.
What are the reasons? Ober-Lix says: The players of golf-coy are freshwaters, the comanders are uncoordinated....
Thats the reasons? i don't think so....
I was in german federal armed forces,too. Not 35 years like Ober-Lix but 8 years as group leader.
I think that is anough basic for an airsoft game like Berget.
So we stop playing on friday noon, after an bad trying to get us embrace.
At saturday morning we pack our things and go.
To Berget-Crew: Where are the Marshalls? iĺl never saw them.
Thanks to all members of Golf Coy, particulary Buckmaster, Salvador and Bloodhound to stay with us.
Thanks for members of the Bravo Coy.
Also thanks to Conrad Mercs, the only opponents i've seen the hole time.

Excused my bad english, i speak much better than i write.

best recards
IC dead people
Nemesis Airsoft Team
Germany
"Size does matter!"

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Post by GaMBiT » 30 Jun 2008, 20:31

In much terms I agree with Bloodhound and Salvador! I was MEDIC in Golf Company, 1st. Platoon and served under Buckmaster's command first. I had Bloodhound and Salvador in my tent and that way we shared most of our experiences.

Me and my team arrived Tuesday at 11 in the morning in the NATO Base. From then on, we were building Checkpoints, Bunkers and were guarding the Base 24 hours before the game started.

The Command Structure was very chaotic and we sometimes didn't know what was going on, because everybody was telling something else. But all the time, we were the ones protecting the base. Three times our Company walked to the Merc' Base and came back with sad faces. Two more times we all got mashed up. We were guarding or just dying because nobody gave a Shit about us. Everbody was upset, but nobody refused his loyalty. I know that our tent always used the chain of command for complains.

We resignated very early, but we did our Jobs as told so. In our Sparetime, we tried to get things funny. Because of the people, this worked.

I know that Ober-Lix took complains by heart and tried to give us some good news. I know that this is sometimes very hard, but honestly said:

You all commanders wanted us to act as soldiers. You commanded us as soldiers. Therefore we wanted to receive acceptance as a soldier.
The HQ just gave shit for GOLF Coy and their Soldiers. You treated us 2nd Rank. A soldier must not be treated 2nd rank if you want him to function.

I know that the "Chip-Mission for Golf" was kind of a test. But conditions were unfair. 90% on the truck wanted to do the Mission for Timo. They were pride doing a job for, and with their fellows.

I am really upset about that dumbasses too, that ruined the mission with their intentions on "killing everyone passing their way". I am ashamed that these assholes were in Golf. And I fully understand why the mission then was canceled. But this another drop in the crate, finally the last one that made it explode.

In the Eyes of GOLF COY nobody gave a shit and therefore most of them left earlier (if the were able to).

I maybe will come to Berget in 1or 2 years,but hen I bring my own car, more friends and absolutely will do my own thing if I see that Berget and HQ don't have a clue again.

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Post by RRP Taksi » 30 Jun 2008, 20:47

Thanx 4 being good enemies and allies! C U NXT YR!!! :D
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/Taksi, SRP "DOG 1-0"
Mmh..

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Post by Bloodhound » 30 Jun 2008, 21:06

GaMBiT wrote:In much terms I agree with Bloodhound and Salvador! I was MEDIC in Golf Company, 1st. Platoon and served under Buckmaster's command first. I had Bloodhound and Salvador in my tent and that way we shared most of our experiences.

Me and my team arrived Tuesday at 11 in the morning in the NATO Base. From then on, we were building Checkpoints, Bunkers and were guarding the Base 24 hours before the game started.

The Command Structure was very chaotic and we sometimes didn't know what was going on, because everybody was telling something else. But all the time, we were the ones protecting the base. Three times our Company walked to the Merc' Base and came back with sad faces. Two more times we all got mashed up. We were guarding or just dying because nobody gave a Shit about us. Everbody was upset, but nobody refused his loyalty. I know that our tent always used the chain of command for complains.

We resignated very early, but we did our Jobs as told so. In our Sparetime, we tried to get things funny. Because of the people, this worked.

I know that Ober-Lix took complains by heart and tried to give us some good news. I know that this is sometimes very hard, but honestly said:

You all commanders wanted us to act as soldiers. You commanded us as soldiers. Therefore we wanted to receive acceptance as a soldier.
The HQ just gave shit for GOLF Coy and their Soldiers. You treated us 2nd Rank. A soldier must not be treated 2nd rank if you want him to function.

I know that the "Chip-Mission for Golf" was kind of a test. But conditions were unfair. 90% on the truck wanted to do the Mission for Timo. They were pride doing a job for, and with their fellows.

I am really upset about that dumbasses too, that ruined the mission with their intentions on "killing everyone passing their way". I am ashamed that these assholes were in Golf. And I fully understand why the mission then was canceled. But this another drop in the crate, finally the last one that made it explode.

In the Eyes of GOLF COY nobody gave a shit and therefore most of them left earlier (if the were able to).

I maybe will come to Berget in 1or 2 years,but hen I bring my own car, more friends and absolutely will do my own thing if I see that Berget and HQ don't have a clue again.
@ team Nemesis and team OAV:

You can call on me anytime! I had a great time playing with you! Maybe there will be other / better events!
-----Berget 6 - NATO Forces - Golf 1------

-----DARKWORLD AIRSOFT SQUAD-------

--------Royal Dutch Navy Reserve---------

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Post by McCloud » 30 Jun 2008, 21:14

I also have to say that unfortunately I am pretty disappointed. First of all, I have to say that I know that it is hard to coordinate as many people and squads that we had, but I believe that this is where us, NATO, had the biggest holes. When I looked back at how the Finnish guys attacked us, and compare it to how we defended our convoy, I have to say that we looked like 2 year olds. Everyone was running everywhere, no one took real charge of the situation and even though they had a preferable position, the result of that firefight was rather sad.
Also, I believe that NATO could have done a lot more action wise. For example, I remember that many times, most of the NATO camp was just lying in front of their tents, waiting for missions. If there were no mission provided by Berget Crew, I believe that it is the HQ's job to make some missions up. How many times did we attack other bases, and compare to how many times we were attacked? We had constant (small and big) attacks at our base, so if there were no missions, a few squads could have been sent to attack a base. Would make at least two teams (NATO + Opposition) a lot happier and people would feel that they got their moneys worth. I thought that this event would be eventful, that we would get to our base, refill our magazines and be assigned to a different mission right away, without much time to pick my nose. Unfortunately, I was picking my nose most of the time and was out of the base not as many times as I had expected, given the magnitude of...well, everything about Berget.
I understand that the HQ made a lot of effort and its hard, but I really feel sorry for the German guys, because all it would have taken to a) make them happy and b) (for the HQ) to shut them up, would be to send them to attack a base and everyone would be happy!
As far as BE is concerned, I have to say that I was impressed and I guess that since I saw all the organization, vehicles, shops etc. at check-in, my expectations increased. Only problem was with the toilets, or the lack of...really feel sorry for the girls at NATO base :cry:
Also, the way NATO attacked everything, with HUGE numbers, no tactics, no sneaking around and through their front gates was a bad option in my opinion, but I guess its up the the HQ to coordinate everything...
With this post, I am not trying to cry like a baby, but I think everyone would benefit if some people take the complaints to their hearts, so that more people attending B7 can have a great time!

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Post by Ukkosleka » 30 Jun 2008, 21:24

I got prettymuch no feedback to nato as a whole, but I'd like to take the oppourtunity to thank that heroic danish medic who healed me twice along a huge pile of other finns. Its a shame I didnt catch your name or nickname. Had I seen you at the beerparty, you would have gotten a free beer :P

You really like your job too much :D

(Forum thanks delivered as promised)

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Post by Johanna » 30 Jun 2008, 22:19

Hi everyone!

I was the one throwing toasts yor way in the Nato base shop!

Just wanted to say I had a great time chatting with a lot of you. So many great stories, so much fun speaking Swedish, English AND my own home made version of Italian :) Sooo many nice, cute guys!

The day of the Beer Party on Saturday was my birth day, and it was one of the best I've had! Thank you so much for the singing, the light stick presents :D and all the hugs.

I didn't get a chanse to see life in the other camps, but I think you in the Nato base really personified what airsoft should be all about: Great companionship, lots of smiling faces... and guys in uniforms! :)

Thank you all! And see you at Berget 7 for sure!

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Post by vinni » 30 Jun 2008, 22:40

I, as a standard rifleman stationed in Golf 2, have to admit that the mission to the UN base came out as a dissapointment, and we were -at that moment- pretty pissed after 14 or 16 (dunno anymore) hours of QRF.

But in hindsight tough, we had a marvelous time, the QRF actually had some kind of a sundey-skirm feeling, execpt for the quick part :lol: Everytime we tried to make coffee, we heard contact at the first sip we took :D
On one occasion I even charged into battle armed with my FNC and a toast 8) (and it tasted good, thx Johanna :))

I would like to thank Berget-Events and NATO command for all the things that went good but i'm not blaming them specifically fo what didn't, it all just came with bad timing.

As for personal thanks, i'd like to thank all the players that really went along with the game, my team mates who were really nice guys to play with, the Viking who healed me on two occasions, the guys who dragged me to a medic, the medics in general and all of the 'Little Guantanamo visitors' who played along really nice. And of course also the diplomat who got me out of the GCM camp before they tortured me :P
B6: NATO
B7: Orlov Corp
B8: Poldavian III Mntrs
B9: Poldavian III Mntrs
BX: Poldavian BRF
BXI: Blood Raven Recon
BXII: Blood Raven CO
BXIII: Cerberus BAT CO
BXIV: UPIR Senior Management
BXV: UPIR HQ resident cripple
BXVI: UPIR old fart
BXVII: GFM HQ
BXVIII: Yes

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Post by samson » 30 Jun 2008, 23:43

Everybody in NATO, thanks. Opponents for giving us hell, thanks. And all I would like to say about Golf being inexperienced.....Who commanded and defended the base against the huge Red attack on thursday?
Yes that was Golf, all the replacement commanders. Lexxie from AG for the East flank, WhiteAce for the south flank. And I coordinated in general, filling the gaps and keeping the overview. And as I recall, we retalliated in a few minutes and after 15/30 minutes all the more then 150 reds were kicked out. Great job everybody who helped keeping the base alive. Am proud that I served with you, and once again we all did a great job!!!!!!

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Post by Brujo » 01 Jul 2008, 06:31

Just a short hello from the airport to my next mission...

Thanks to everyone for participating and giving their best, when I wasn't given trauma i loved working with you all.
Second, a BIG apology to Golf players. Few idiots within your company dragged down the morale and lack of company leadership failed to forward this to me until it was too late. But you know what? I am playing the red side from now on. Hardcore, no whining, happy with every kind of action to the last individual. Shame on you people for trying to blame those who gave effort.
BE, you were a total dissapointment to me this year, YOU should have attended golf, not me. I have a detailed email flying your way. Next year forget about me CO-ing.

The rest 90% of players, Bravo, Fox, Golf, Oscar, Indias... you were a true joy to a CO. Oberlix, thanks for the help and some authentic discussions. Loved working with you.

f... boarding started.. :evil:
B5 - Soviet VDV Battalion Commander
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Post by Salvador » 01 Jul 2008, 10:05

Just in short FYI:

I received a PM from Berget crew -after my post in which I told I would be consulting my lawyer for refund possibilities- in which they gave me the general terms as good information.

Only thing I want to share is that general terms are not always lawful -even when accepted-, they have to be reasonable and fulfill expectations. So for example if it says that Berget provides toilets; you may expect (perhaps also according by -local- law) that more than 4 toilets on couple of hundred people are being provided...

Not my intention to bring Berget down, but to reason. They can end this situation the easy way... Not by being a smart ass.

I hope Stirling Airsoft in the UK can show how things be done at their event at Copehill Down.

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Post by Ukkosleka » 01 Jul 2008, 10:27

I'm brobably going to start a flame war, but believe me, it is not my intention.

Honestly I believe that you are the one being unreasonable. How could you expect them to fulfill every players expectations? So you had a bad experience? Shit happens. Why do you have to spread that bad feeling around others who actually enjoyed themselves? Don't you think it's a bit childish to raise a lawsuit just because you didn't have as much fun as you thought you would?

Have you even considered that you actually misunderstood the event beforehand? Maybe, just maybe the event actually went pretty much as planned. 50% offensive means 50% defensive. Someone has to sit at the base and do guard duty. I sat in the woods the whole day 2 being eaten by mosquitos and you don't see me complaining.

I think really many players had a different experience than they expected. How bout instead of whining like a 10-year old, you be a man give some constructive critisism, like everybody else.

I'm sorry if I start an ugly argument with this, it truly isn't my intention. I just had to say something, as I feel Salvador is being somewhat unreasonable.

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Post by Salvador » 01 Jul 2008, 10:49

Best Ukkosleka,

Thanks for your reply and I understand in a way your opinion.
My last post was also my last -public- post (now this one will be :P).

You probably misread my previous posts. Cause guard duty is part of the job for everybody, but just an part... I have read nowhere that the game would mean 50% of the camp permanently on missions and 50% of the camp on permanent guard duty. If so than please state this in mission statement of the upcoming event. In my personal opinion this is not a childless complaint on personal expectations of a professional airsoft event.

I also would like to ask all not to start a flame war, but just to express their feelings/ experience of the event.

Surely we want to be constructive, but only when we can have a dialogs. But sadly for now it is one-way traffic only...

Again my intention is to let the ones who feel powerless and ignored be heard. Which is quite difficult....

Final words:
- Next time decrease the amount of participating party's, which will make the mission editing a lot easier for organization/command.
- i.e. 9am wake and 10am in full gear for mission briefing is not 13pm mission briefing, better timetabling or sidemissions.
- Put up few more tents or allow special minitents for gear and toilets
- Arrange some form of shuttle transport for travel to main safe/ parking (due to lack of space we used the car as additional warehouse)

Salvador out :lol:
Last edited by Salvador on 01 Jul 2008, 13:07, edited 1 time in total.

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